Spirited Away

[summercomfort]

whew. thought and plotted paper until 11-ish. Saw there was still time to catch the 11:30 Spirited Away, so scampered hence. Mousie, Cassie, Annie, etc! Very Very Sorry! I had to squeeze out that drop of paper-plotting....

But anyway, now, on my second watching, and this time in dubbed... I finally realized how beautiful it really is... an intricate blend of East and West... Which makes people versed only in one aspect slightly confused and weirded out by the parts they don't understand. I'm sure everyone can admire the pretty gothic churchlike station, and the ferry, etc. Now, in the present audience (Karen, Jeanne, Jen), I'm hardly the expert on Japanese mythology, but I'll still try to address some of the potentially weird parts that hit me while re-watching it. (partly by the "huh"s expressed by the audience.)



Pigs - surely people understand that pigs are considered sluggish, gluttonous, good-for-nothings. Natural.

Herbs - actually, alternative medicine is around enough to have people understand.

Witches - the twin good/evil thing. I've seen other such twin witches floating around, but it's Japanese mythology, so I'm not that clear on it. The transformation into a bird thing, now that's kinda normal. Transformation is one of the most basic magic that people learn. (none of this power bolt and mind-reading/Sight stuff.) It's all about summoning clouds to fly upon, and transformation. The more transformations you can do, the cooler you are. The more spirits/elements you can summon/control, the spiffier you are. Oh, and once you've achieved "magic" status, you're immortal like the elves (can't die of natural causes).

Dragons - Mushu's fire-spitting didn't help improve the Asian dragon image. Dragons are water gods. Well, rather, they claim water as their territory. The most powerful dragons are lords of the oceans. Then come the bigger rivers, and then the smaller rivers. So it's natural that Haku used to live in a river. (However, that's different from a river god. They're actually the river.)

"Granny" - really, it's not that weird. It's not like "I'm gonna adopt you as family now", but rather a term both of endearment and respect. (respect b/c you aren't calling their direct name, but also endearment b/c they're not strangers. So it's like "you're a friend and elder and I respect you")

Also noticed some cool parts like the train... the juxtaposition of real world and spirit world. Chihiro could have gotten off at the "Real World" stops, but she decided to continue and save Haku. (no other chance for her... no more tickets)

Also caught the hex thing with the stomping of the slug. Yay!

I love the inspiration tag on their work in/out board!

Something that confused me: the bathhouse had large characters of "oil" (yo) on it, and "soup" on the chiminy. Do they mean "salve" and "bath" in Japanese or something? cause otherwise it sounds like "we're gonna cook soup with your yummy bodies! mwahahaha!"



In other aspects, the dubbing is very well done. Haku is a tiny bit stale, but he was in the original, as well.


Add: OMG, "glomp" isn't a word? ::traumatized::

Comments

Re: Woohoo, I *am* a cultural moron!

[summercomfort]

no you're not. Or rather, everyone is.

I don't know anything about Japanese mythology, only general Chinese (some of which you find traces of in Japanese).

Here's my take on No-Face:

He is the mystery man, he has no identity, no home. That's why he wanders around, lost and mildly confused. When Chihiro invited him in, it's as if he was offered a home, so he was grateful to Chihiro. He had to absorb a frog to be able to be *someone*. The river god scene taught him that he can get others to like him and serve him by giving gold. He is driven by a desire to belong, to absorb, to be filled, to be someone important and noticed. When Chihiro rejects him and gives him the river god medicine, he can't *be* anyone or anything anymore, which is why he was so angry. But Chihiro still accepts him for being No-Face, so he follows her, until he finally finds a home with Zeniba.

(where did he learn weaving? don't know!)

Re: Woohoo, I *am* a cultural moron!

[cowofthemoon.livejournal.com]

I agree w/ Sushu, his character is mostly about identity and belonging.

He's always like. Love me, understand me, react to me... here is gold, aha! that works, I'll do it again... but then of course the understanding that gold brings never fills you up, no matter how big you get.

That's why he's attracted to Chihiro, because he's tried the gold trick and it hasn't brought him belonging, or he only thought that he belonged until Chihiro fed him the herbal pellet and he realized that was all fake, that's why he follows her instead of going back to the bath-house and using gold again.

Maybe he's also attracted to her because she doesn't belong either.

(Sushu's explaination I could agree with)

Sort of ironic how No-Face is trying so hard to get a place in the bath-house, but he can't, and Haku and Chichiro are trying so hard to get back to their "real" identities outside of the bath-house.

A lot of the film is about identity

Haku doesn't know his identity either, becuase Yubaba has stolen his... name Same w/ the parents turning into pigs, losing their identity.

And of course it's the innocent child (Chihiro) who Figures out who the stink god is, deals correctly with No-Face, finds Haku's name and who can identify her parents...

That's the way it works in children's stories, (and in platonic philosophy). Everyone else is so caught up and grown up that they can't remember who they are really.

I think he learned weaving because at that instant he needed to know weaving... or maybe he knew it all along by instinct and only had to find his place.

No face is the best because he's ambiguous and you can get all kinds of theories.


I think Yubaba is a reference to Baba Yaga (Slavic Mythology), Big Scary Grandmother Witch, who is sometimes evil and sometimes good.

Baba Yaga is called Grandmother, and she can fly, only with a mortar and pestle... not with a cloak. And her hut has chicken legs and she has skulls on her fence.

still, if they animated Baba Yaga I think she'd look exactly like Yubaba does in "Spirited Away"

It could be that Japanese Mythology has a similar figure. I bet most cultures have a witch figure. I looked through my Diety's/Mythology encyclopedia but I couldn't find any Japanese Equivalent.

Re: Woohoo, I *am* a cultural moron!

[summercomfort]

agree with most of what you say. (Baby gets identity, too!)

I see your analogy to Baba Yaga (::remembers reading Orson Scott Card's Enchantment::), but the thing is, I've seen these witches elsewhere. Alwasy the huge head, the hooked nose, and always twins. (not necessarily good/evil, but still twins)

I thought Vampire when I saw the trailer, but it wasn't *that* vampire in the movie. (imho. ::remembers kiki inviting vampires inside::

Wow, this has been an awesome discussion! And just yesterday, Lucy IMed me to argue about the focus on transformations in Japanese mythology vs Chinese mythology and their roots.

Re: Woohoo, I *am* a cultural moron!

[cowofthemoon.livejournal.com]

To Mr. Pata:

yeah... I had similar thoughts. When he came in when Chihiro invited him... I was like: Vampire! but then I had to rethink when he changed

Didn't Yubaba call no-face something when she had that talk with Chihiro just before Chihiro gave him the herbal pellet?

Am I imagining that?

Not on a mythology note bue

[sneaselcouth.livejournal.com]

I thought the story was an amazing blend of cultures that Miyazaki, with all his experiences, accomplishes seamlessly! A lot of his common messages and themes prevail here too. The "Be Kind to Nature" theme of Mononoke with the River God becoming a Stink Spirit after being filled with sludge. "Dont be Greedy" with No-Face and "Have faith in those you love" with Haku telling Chihiro to "Not look Back" after she reunites with her parents. For you guys who know Eastern Mythologies, is there a story there like the ones present in Greek and Biblical Myths? Where Lot's wife can't look back but does and becomes a pillar of salt or...blanked on the names..but that guy goes to rescue his love from hades (In the disney movie, it was Hercules, but I didnt think it was in the actual myth) and he can't look back else she her soul will return, and he does. I felt that Miyazaki was saying you had to have faith in those you loved here by paralleling these stories, but does Japan have a similar myth?

That thing you ^ pointed out about the Slavic witch and Yubaba is really interesting! And all the analysese (right wy ato pluralize word?) here of No-Face are awesome. I agree that he epitomized the loss of Identity that occured within the bath house. He has no identity to begin with and so must be acknowledge and invited in. But it makes him sick to remain there, or so Chihiro remarks. He had no face intially and perhaps loses even more upon entrance. Hmm...but yeah, you guys clarified a lot about his character for me. Awesome! ^_^

[conejita.livejournal.com]

no face: >I thought he just needed someone to open the door, he can't go thru walls...<

dragons: haha that would make fogarthke also a water god.. ah well can't be helped Salamanders and dragons are the official western fire animals

I thought it was yu (the hiragana) on the bath house, which means hot water

I want to know the significance of the ducks and the ginger root spirit! >ok maybe they're just comic relief<

it's funny how identity has so much to do with the people around us, can we really have an identity without anyone else?